It is currently Tue May 21, 2013 1:36 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 38 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 6:04 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 9:49 am
Posts: 27
FIAT2LUX wrote:
Weaself wrote:
Thanks for the explanation, it helps very much. Looking forward to some break from school and work.

PS. Remember that I'm in a different time zone. ;)


Ahead or behind me? :)


About 6 hours ahead (if you are in the US).


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 6:29 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:27 pm
Posts: 219
Location: North Carolina, US
Alright. Btw, I'm in the Eastern US. We have like 4 different time zones from the Eastern US to the Western side of Alaska. There might even be a few more time zones out that way. I'm in the EDT which I think is Zulu -4, and then after daylight savings is over we revert to EST which is Zulu -5. So I take you're in Europe?

_________________
FIAT LUX! Translation = "Let there be light!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 7:41 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 9:49 am
Posts: 27
Yes, I'm from Poland. I saw you were from North Carolina so I estimated the difference is about 6 hours but might be wrong.

Btw. You guys write that sports are good for eyes, but what about martial arts? I mean grappling, that is rolling on the ground. It doesn't involve getting hit in the head, only occasionally falling down. Is that good for the eyes?

What about the gym? I hear different opinions, even from optometrists themselves. One of them said that any sport other than cycling and swimming is not good for your eyes. Do you have any data on that?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 8:20 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 4:01 pm
Posts: 872
Location: Fishkill, NY (USA)
Weaself, you wrote
Quote:
I hear different opinions, even from optometrists themselves. One of them said that any sport other than cycling and swimming is not good for your eyes.
This kind of generalization really makes me angry. For all we know, maybe this doctor had a bad personal experience with sports himself, so now is proclaiming they're "bad" for everyone! Moving your body and eyes is natural and healthy, and many modern "diseases" come from being too sedentary. Sports involving a ball are great for vision improvement and eye/hand coordination. Use your common sense about getting hit in the head, sure, but don't use this poor advice as a reason to remain inactive. Doctors may know their narrow field of study somewhat, but they don't know everything.

_________________
Nancy
2012: 20/45 on average, no glasses except for night driving
2001: 2/200, -10 hard contacts with -1.75 cylinder
Vision & dreams blog: http://dreamersight.wordpress.com/
Vision & dreams website: http://dreamersight.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 8:38 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 11:46 am
Posts: 251
Location: France
Weaself wrote:
btw. As for speed reading-do you think fixating your eyes on just one word at a time is fine? I know speed reading involves embracing even whole lines.


According to Bates, there is a good, healthy way to do speed-reading and a harmful one, explained in the better eyesight magazine - so better make sure you do it the right way:

Quote:
Lord Macaulay
By W. H. Bates, M.D.

LORD MACAULAY, who win always hold an eminent place among English men of letters, was born October 25th, 1800 and died December 28th, 1859. Before he was 30 years of age, he became a member of the House of Commons, and later held positions of trust and importance which required him to visit different parts of the world. At one time he wrote a code of laws for the benefit of the people of India and devoted considerable time to the work

Lord Macaulay was said to be the most rapid reader on record, and had the ability to remember perfectly what he had read ten or more years previously, without refreshing his memory by re-reading it. He was able to read a page of five hundred words in one second. Not only could he remember the words that were spelled correctly, but also those words which were spelled incotrectly. He was able to remember the page on which they could be found, the line of the page, the location of the words on the line, and how each word was misspelled. For example, if the word "which" were misspelled, he could remember that it was the fourth word on the fifth line on page 120, and that it was spelled "whiche." This seems a remarkable statement to make, but I have had patients who became able to read almost as rapidly as Lord Macaulay after a course of eye education. This training consisted of central fixation and the imagination of the halos, i.e., the white spaces inside the letters, between the letters and between the lines of letters.

Central fixation is the ability to see best where you are looking and not so clearly where you are not looking. This requires shifting from one part of an object to another part. To have perfect eight, Lord Macaulay unconsciously practiced central fixation. If he had consciously tried to see a letter or to keep his attention fixed on one part of a letter, or if he had tried to see all parts of a letter at once, his vision would have been imperfect. To see the top of a letter perfectly, it was necessary for him to look at and see the top of the letter beat, and the rest of the letter not so well. To see each of the other sides perfectly, it was necessary for him to look at and see each side best, and the rest of the letter not so well. Since the average number of letters in each word is five, he shifted four times five, or twenty times, to see each word with maximum vision. To recognize five hundred words, it was therefore necessary, for him to shift five hundred times twenty, or ten thousand times in one second.

In order to see perfectly, it is necessary that one imagine perfectly. Macaulay remembered or imagined the white spaces between the lines to be whiter than they really were. When the white spaces were imagined perfectly white, the black letters were imagined perfectly black, because the white spaces could not be imagined perfectly, without the black being imagined perfectly at the same time. For the same reason, when the blackness of the letters was imagined perfectly, the forts of the letters was also imagined perfectly. It has been demonstrated that trying to see the black letters is a conscious strain, or is attended by a conscious strain, and always lowers the vision.

It is a truth that one cannot remember a letter perfectly unless it has been seen perfectly. When the memory for one letter is perfect, the memory for all letters is also perfect. A letter cannot be imagined perfectly unless it has been remembered perfectly. It cannot be seen perfectly unless it has been imagined perfectly. We see only what we imagine we see. The speed of reading is greatest when the vision is perfect.

After a course of eye training, some of my patients were able sub-consciously to remember large letters of the Snellen test card, which they had previously regarded, without being conscious of distinguishing any of the letters. Many of these patients have become able to remember or imagine small letters of the test card at thirty, forty, or fifty feet. I have had some patients glance for a few seconds at a page of diamond type at ten feet or further, without consciously reading any of the letters. With their eyes closed and covered with the palms of their hands, some of them became able to re-member or imagine one or more letters of the fine print. They must have unconsciously seen the fine print to have been able to imagine the letters, because one cannot imagine something not remembered, and one cannot remember perfectly unless one has seen perfectly. Therefore, in order to imagine a letter perfectly, it is necessary that the letter be seen previously, either consciously or unconsciously.

The method of rapid reading practiced by Macaulay is invaluable and should be more widely employed.

In my Writings I have remonstrated against the methods employed to teach rapid reading. The usual procedure was to encourage the student to see all of the letters of a word at once, or to see all the letters of a paragraph of words at the same time. This was accepted as the correct method and very intelligent scholars have recommended it. My research work has proved that there is nothing more injurious to the eyes than to make an effort to see a whole letter or a whole word, all parts equally well. If one looks at the first letter of a word, the last letter is not seen perfectly at the same time. If an effort is made, the whole word becomes blurred and may not be distinguished. The stronger the effort that is made, the more injurious it is to the mind and eyes.

In the public schools of the City of New York, teachers ire advised to practice this method of rapid reading with young children. Although the result is unsatisfactory, many teachers still persist in their efforts to teach the impossible. It is interesting to know that children who have perfect mental pictures of letters, or other objects, have a normal memory or a memory that is just as perfect for letters or objects. The scholarship of such children is much better than that of others whose memory or mental pictures are imperfect. A number of school children have told me that at the time of their examinations, they could read a question on the blackboard and have no conception of what the answer might be, but if they closed their eyes and remembered the first letter of the question perfectly, it helped them to remember the answer to the question.

One teacher with a class of children who were mentally deficient, found that the practice of central fixation, palming, and the use of the imagination was of great benefit to the minds of those children. A school teacher in Chicago has made a practice of teaching her pupils how to imagine things perfectly, with the result that no matter how ignorant they may be, at the beginning of the school term, it is not long before they become able to make the same progress as other children in the rapid advancement classes.

The dean of the department of metaphysics of one of our prominent universities came to me and complained that he was suffering with all kinds of mental and eye troubles because he had lost the power of concentration. The strain was so great that he was compelled to give up his work. Glasses were of no benefit. He demonstrated that to concentrate on one letter or one part of a letter it was necessary for him to make an effort, and in a few seconds his vision became very imperfect.

With perfect sight, no effort is made and the eyes and mind are at rest. There is no fatigue, and one can read with great rapidity for many hours continuously, without being conscious of having eyes.

( http://www.central-fixation.com/better- ... 926-10.php )


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 8:28 pm 
Member
Member

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:27 pm
Posts: 219
Location: North Carolina, US
Quote:
Lord Macaulay
By W. H. Bates, M.D.

With perfect sight, no effort is made and the eyes and mind are at rest. There is no fatigue, and one can read with great rapidity for many hours continuously, without being conscious of having eyes.


That's quite interesting. When I have the best reading experience, I am indeed usually quite engrossed in the subject and can care less how I'm looking, but when I think about my eyes I find that they were doing just fine. Very fascinating. Also 30,000 words per minute is pretty impressive, especially if done in that manner. I can hardly fathom 10,000 saccades a second with the eye, but wow!

At least it restores my faith in speed reading if done properly.

Weaself, yeah, I think that was roughly a good estimation of time zone differential.

Also, martial arts often requires concentration and co-ordination, so as long as you don't hurt yourself, it sounds fine. Working out at the gym is totally fine. The thing to remember though is to not stare. You're pushing that really heavy bar up focusing on exhaling, but either close your eyes or analyze the bar position, that sort of thing with whatever you're doing in general, and especially when lifting weights.

General excercise is great. Swimming is awesome if you can do it, running gives you lots of oppositional movement, association football requires eye foot coordination, etc. One of the Federal Health Departments in the US recommends 60 minutes a day of physical activity. It's a great idea of you have the time. The health benefits go to the entire body.

_________________
FIAT LUX! Translation = "Let there be light!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 12:33 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 9:49 am
Posts: 27
I think most people do have 60 minutes to do any activity during the day, theypeople just prefer spending the time in front of TV. Most people I hear say that they have no time for doing any sport, but, surprisingly, they always know what goes on in every series/soap opera on TV. :)

As for benefits, what if you see little sparks when you, say, lift a heavy weight. These sparks are similar to the ones you see during coughing or sneezing. I sometimes see that when I have to use more strength in my sport and I'm a little concerned.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 3:14 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 218
Location: _ _
FIAT2LUX wrote:
Very fascinating. Also 30,000 words per minute is pretty impressive, especially if done in that manner. I can hardly fathom 10,000 saccades a second with the eye, but wow!

At least it restores my faith in speed reading if done properly.


Some people are just born with extraordinary gifts, I suspect that Lord Macaulay was one of those types of people. His vision must have been extraordinary sharp. Not that the average person cannot train themselves to read with great speed, if done properly; it's just that most myopes are already up against an enormous hill to climb just to eliminate stubborn refractive error. To put into practice the principles that Bates was trying to convey will most likely require one to really slow down reading speed in the beginning. To remember perfectly one has to see perfectly, and to see perfectly one has to imagine perfectly. That's a lot of perfectly's... to get right, or get wrong. If we're concerned about our speed too much, that could weigh us down even more, in my experience. I had to really slow down my own, and read as best I could without any more compromise to my vision, to the principles of CF, using the imagination to see the halos, seeing the optical swing, and just being comfortable and relaxed. And it has payed off quite well - I rarely get tired anymore from reading, from using my eyes at close, unless I find myself rushing, ignoring the signals that I'm tensing up. And how you use your eyes at the nearpoint, which many do for a majority of our waking hours - pays handsome dividends to how we use them for vision at all ranges.

Regards,
Andrew


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 5:23 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:27 pm
Posts: 219
Location: North Carolina, US
Thanks Andrew!

Weaself,

By sparks, do you mean things that you see within your eyes, or is it like spit or sweat? If it's something within your eyes and not bodily fluids, then it sounds like you're squeezing your eyeballs, which is not a good thing, and you should experiment to find a way to get rid of that squeezing while doing whatever activity you were doing when it occurred.

_________________
FIAT LUX! Translation = "Let there be light!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 9:13 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 11:46 am
Posts: 251
Location: France
arocarty wrote:
Some people are just born with extraordinary gifts, I suspect that Lord Macaulay was one of those types of people. His vision must have been extraordinary sharp.


According to Bates, some of his patients have not only been cured sucessfully from their error of refraction, but have reached almost Lord Macaulay's reading speed:

Quote:
This seems a remarkable statement to make, but I have had patients who became able to read almost as rapidly as Lord Macaulay after a course of eye education.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 9:54 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 11:30 am
Posts: 433
30,000 words per minute?! :o

Forgive me for my skepticism, but 30,000 words per minute is 500 words per second. That would be the equivalent of reading about a page a second, wouldn't it? Seems a bit superhuman to me...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 10:14 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 11:30 am
Posts: 433
To clarify my previous post, I am expressing amazement at what the human body can achieve naturally. I've never really been amazed by "magic" tricks, but things like this just really makes me stop for a second and say "wow!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 11:29 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 218
Location: _ _
Nini wrote:
According to Bates, some of his patients have not only been cured successfully from their error of refraction, but have reached almost Lord Macaulay's reading speed:

Quote:
This seems a remarkable statement to make, but I have had patients who became able to read almost as rapidly as Lord Macaulay after a course of eye education.


Well, we don't really know what the state of their vision was before they were treated - it could have been slightly bad, or already normal - as someone who just wanted even better vision. He doesn't say, we just don't know. An important qualification there - "after" a course in eye education, and that was at the hands of the best in the business, Bates himself. 'After' they learned the principles of CF, and use of the imagination. Who knows how long and what they had to go through to get there. My point was mainly that we shouldn't get ahead of ourselves, take it one day at a time, it can be a long, tough road. Remarkable things will come to those who learn correctly, even great reading speeds to some. But focus on learning correctly first. Every day when I look in the distance and see with perfect clarity, I find it remarkable, even after it's been a few years that I've returned to this level. I find it remarkable that I'm not groping around for reading or distances lenses, as so many are around me. I find it remarkable that I am much more composed, and have much less anxiety in situations where I used to feel uncontrollable anxiety. I hope that anyone who really wants it, can find what they're looking for too.

Regards,

Andrew


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:48 pm 
Member
Member

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:27 pm
Posts: 219
Location: North Carolina, US
Pikachu,

Yeah, 30,000 words per minute is amazing. I personally know someone who can do it with probably 60% comprehension, but the amount of detail Macaulay could recall at that speed was fantastic! It is indeed fascinating that the human body is capable of such a feat. Although I was honestly more impressed with the amount of shifts required than the reading speed. 10,000 per second, times 60 is 60,000 shifts per minute! Now where's that big eyed smiley face… Oh! Here it is! :o

Andrew,

What do you think your average Snellen acuity is right now?

_________________
FIAT LUX! Translation = "Let there be light!"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2012 3:46 am 
Member
Member

Joined: Mon May 10, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 218
Location: _ _
FIAT2LUX wrote:
Andrew,

What do you think your average Snellen acuity is right now?


I've been a little lax with chart practice lately, but based on the last couple days of indoor Snellen chart readings I'm still hovering around the 20/20 mark. I can read the 20/20 line from 20, 25, and sometimes 30 feet. Sometimes it'll fluctuate a little worse, to around 20/40. Things operate a little better with both eyes together - they seem to like being a team, whereas by themselves they get more stubborn when I go back beyond around the 20 ft. mark.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 38 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next


All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group