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+--- Thread: new article / site update (/showthread.php?tid=1647)
Re: new article / site update - Nancy - 11-12-2010
Getting despondent when my sight is blurry because I then assume this means I'm not relaxed enough just puts me in "try to relax" mode (an oxymoron if there ever was one), which isn't usually very productive. Noting that my sight is blurry because I'm not looking for details gives me somewhere to go with the idea, something positive to do. This not only produces results of clearer sight, it feels empowering.
Re: new article / site update - Pikachu - 11-12-2010
@David: I guess most people feel that clear flashes come when you're relaxed. In a way, it's true though, isn't it? If you're properly using your eyes, you will be relaxed. On the other hand, if you are relaxed, you might not necessarily be using your eyes properly. So are you saying that the searching of details will help bring about a conscious understanding of these clear flashes, so that it's not all in the subconscious?
Re: new article / site update - David - 11-13-2010
Pikachu Wrote:@David: I guess most people feel that clear flashes come when you're relaxed. In a way, it's true though, isn't it? If you're properly using your eyes, you will be relaxed. On the other hand, if you are relaxed, you might not necessarily be using your eyes properly. So are you saying that the searching of details will help bring about a conscious understanding of these clear flashes, so that it's not all in the subconscious?
It might seem as if something is happening in your subconscious because you don't notice what you did differently, but good vision is just a matter of doing the right things and not doing the wrong things. It sounds like you're trying to approach it as learning something intellectually.
Dave
Re: new article / site update - otto - 11-14-2010
Nancy Wrote:Getting despondent when my sight is blurry because I then assume this means I'm not relaxed enough just puts me in "try to relax" mode (an oxymoron if there ever was one), which isn't usually very productive. Noting that my sight is blurry because I'm not looking for details gives me somewhere to go with the idea, something positive to do. This not only produces results of clearer sight, it feels empowering.
That about sums up my response to David's new article. Well said! It is empowering! Because it gets results.
Searching for details and having it be both relaxing and getting sustained clarity puts to rest my prior confusion about how to respond to blur. A lot of us were left with a conundrum: what to do with the blur, and a lot of us just let the blur discourage us. "Accept the blur" we have heard in the past from those trying to help promote relaxation and effortlessness. And it was easy to take that advice to mean "don't try". Trying is not the same as straining. Sounds obvious but I am still learning.
My question for David is, and I know this has been asked in different contexts but, can you comment on seeing in low light, low contrast environments. In low contrast situations the details don't seem to be there. It's hard to get engaged in the scenery. Any advice?
Re: new article / site update - sean - 11-15-2010
Hi Otto
Good question and one I've been meaning to ask too.
Re: new article / site update - Nancy - 11-15-2010
Me three about the low light situation. I find myself looking closer where at least I can see some detail to work with, and also using my imagination even more, but I'd love some guidance on this. I'm trying to be a normal-sighted person, building up a coherent image from scraps of very little, but really feel like I'm in The Unknown.
Re: new article / site update - Pikachu - 11-15-2010
David Wrote:It might seem as if something is happening in your subconscious because you don't notice what you did differently, but good vision is just a matter of doing the right things and not doing the wrong things. It sounds like you're trying to approach it as learning something intellectually.
Dave
I'll take that as a compliment
Interestingly enough, this intellectual approach is something I use in just about everything I do. I understand that it kills the fun for some people, but for me, finding answers to profound questions makes the Bates method all the more exciting for me. In fact, it's what got me into the Bates method in the first place. I finally started asking myself: Why is is that other people have 20/20 vision but I don't? Is there some way to do it naturally? Well, I later found out that there was actually a lot of stuff devoted to this "Bates method". Nowadays, the Bates method is more like a hobby (some might call it an obsession) than anything else. I don't HAVE to do it; I just do it because I want to.
Re: new article / site update - David - 11-17-2010
otto Wrote:My question for David is, and I know this has been asked in different contexts but, can you comment on seeing in low light, low contrast environments. In low contrast situations the details don't seem to be there. It's hard to get engaged in the scenery. Any advice?
So at night you aren't as engaged with fewer things to see. Here's the thing. If you aren't interested in anything, find a way to be. You have to really want to see smaller and smaller details, especially when you're in this situation still learning the right way to do it. You can't fake it. You have to be sincerely there as the driving force.
Don't make the mistake of trying to establish a seeing pattern for yourself that can run on autopilot while you think about something else. People with normal vision can think about other things and still see correctly only because they have pretty much perfected their function of seeing. Until then, it requires too much of your attention to leave alone and trust.
Another issue - Practicing this and adjusting your way of seeing messes with your orientation, and while driving at night, or to an extent even just while walking, you kind of need to stay oriented to avoid an accident. Obviously it's safer to see in the right way, but during the transition period while you're learning and adjusting to it, it's disorienting and not as safe, so it would make sense to feel some conflict and anxiety about it that is actually more or less justified. That's why I recommend sitting down in a safe place.
Dave
Re: new article / site update - David - 11-19-2010
I got to thinking more on low light - If there is anything at all to see besides pitch black, there are details of the same size available as any other time. Dig into them and search for the smallest piece you can. Just like in bright light, it's still simply a matter of finding the smallest piece you can, looking at it, finding another, and continuing to do that without stopping.
It just doesn't make sense to not be looking for the smallest detail whatever you're looking at. It doesn't matter how good or bad your vision is, or how long you've been into this. It's the only way to actually look at anything. Otherwise you're not really looking at anything; you're just pointing your eyes in a general direction without having any interest in finding out more about what's there. That kind of diffused attention isn't the best way to accomplish anything, much less see.
Trying to be interested in what you're looking at becomes a non-issue when you do this. It's confusion, diffusion and strain to do the impossible that makes people uninterested. A small detail is very specific, and every time you look, you've got one and made another little accomplishment. It doesn't even matter much if it's clear, blurry or scattered. You still nailed that one detail, and the one after that, and that's all you're responsible for. That's what your visual system is based around, and your visual system needs that to be done continuously in order to properly focus without really any other intervention on your part.
Dave
Re: new article / site update - Nancy - 11-19-2010
Your sentence "Trying to be interested in what you're looking at becomes a non-issue when you do this." hit me, and made me think of "trying to see". If I'm actually interested, instead of trying to be interested, my eyes will naturally look for details.
Re: new article / site update - Andrea Major - 11-22-2010
I consider myself "censored out" for having my response "split-out". Dave, you have asked for feedback... You didn't say only positive ones are welcome, next time make sure you do and I'll be sure to keep my mouth shut.... (let's see what you do with this one ;-))
Re: new article / site update - David - 11-22-2010
Andrea Major Wrote:I consider myself "censored out" for having my response "split-out". Dave, you have asked for feedback... You didn't say only positive ones are welcome, next time make sure you do and I'll be sure to keep my mouth shut.... (let's see what you do with this one ;-))
Obviously I welcome constructive criticism from people who actually try it and have problems. Your post came off as simply a knee-jerk reaction to the fact that I wasn't parroting Bates, and you took the opportunity to slam the whole thing. You didn't offer any specific feedback on how it could be improved, problems you encounter with it, or confusion in how I described something. That's why I feel your post did not fit in this thread. And the whole subject of presenting the Bates method exactly as Bates did vs. a modified approach is likely to open up some heated debate, which I know from past experience, and deserves a whole separate thread to keep things here focused.
Dave
Re: new article / site update - David - 11-29-2010
Just a quick note - I'm working on a major revision of the article now based on feedback. It's still based around looking for details, but with all the stuff I'm adding and changing, I think you'll find that the procedure will be more accessible even to people with severe degrees of myopia, and it shouldn't result in people just staring at the eye chart and making their vision worse by trying to see things that they can't see. I was off the mark in my estimate of how prone most people are to do that.
Re: new article / site update - Nancy - 11-29-2010
Good. I am starting to know (feel) the difference between searching for details and staring, which was my normal way of looking for most of my life. It's been endlessly frustrating to me since I started exploring NVI that people with pretty good sight try to help me, and when I do what I think they are telling me to, I just strain more. It started with trying to relax! Thank you.
Re: new article / site update - Deliverance - 11-29-2010
I'm feeling great, and fine since I started working with 'search for details' process. I feel a bit more relaxed (Still I can feel that feeling of tired, or even hot eyes sensation) when I'm practicing it, as well my acuity has improved also a bit.. Can't wait for that update!
Thanks!.