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double vision, due to astigmatism? - Printable Version

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double vision, due to astigmatism? - lou_deg - 07-18-2012

Hi, I'm a new member and it's great to find this site.
Question for you folks. I see mainly double images in each eye, although some ghosting from multiple images. It becomes very noticeable when driving and looking at a traffic light. From far, I see two lights, side by side, and as I approach, it merges to one. When I wear glasses (-1.75D and up) with no astigmatism correction, the double vision goes away.
It's been mentioned that monocular double vision is due to astigmatism. But having different focus points along the two axes should just cause blur or distortion. I use an electron microscope which have controls for changing the astigmation in x and y axes but I am unable to produce double images...just a blurry, distorted image.
How does a single eye produce double vision? (Is the eye behaving like it consists of two lenses?)
Do others here see double images to some degree? How did you improve it?
(I have a curvature in my backbone, which led to unbalanced posture, muscles in my back/neck/eyes(?) and I suspect is a cause of my astigmatism.) -thanks, Lou


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - clarknight - 07-18-2012

To lou_deg,

Wow, many things you listed ring true.

Double, triple... images are common from astigmatism. Astigmatism can often cure itself; comes, then goes. Sounds like you have the astigmatism at distance only? Is vision in one eye less clear? Improving it to equal, both eyes clear will be a great help.

I had a broken (mis-aligned) neck in 4 places and hips, lower back, shoulder vertebrae mis-aligned by treatment from a dishonest chiropractor. It resulted in many health and vision problems including astigmatism, slow left eye... Cured it with David's looking at details, shifting... on the lines of an astigmatism chart and general Bates method and physical therapy...

I would like to help you cure this - FREE. Sounds like it will be easy to do. You also seem like the type of person that will listen, learn easy gain fast results. See my profile and send a e-mail. I can do free Skype, phone. Prefer that to e-mail because my neck is still healing and typing not best for the neck. I can send a couple e-mails with basic directions.

Eyeglasses create astigmatism and an astigmatism prescription in the eyeglass lens maintains, increases the tension in the tense outer eye muscle, muscles that are causing the abnormal eye, cornea shape and astigmatism. So you are right to not wear glasses with astigmatism correction. I think the plain glasses may be blocking out the less clear vision in one eye or something?? and that's making the double images go away when wearing the plain, no astigmatism glasses. Try to go without glasses. If you must wear for driving; learn the reduced 20/40 weaker procedure.

Double vision can also be caused if the eyes are not perfectly aligned, converging, diverging perfectly, exact, equally. Lot of people have this and don't ever know it. Have occasional astigmatism, then it just disappears. I can help you with this. Usually, just getting the vision equal will make the eyes work together, exact, perfect. David cured strabismus with relaxation, Bates Method. You condition seems minor. What does your eye doctor say?

electron microscope; don't use it! They are a major cause of much strain, tension in the eyes, muscles, brain (visual System). Don't share it with others; if someone has a eye infection, it can spread.

Yes there's a lot of posts here about double, multiple images.
Some students see it as the vision is improving; brain, left and right brain hemispheres balancing, relaxing and different eye muscles relaxing, sometimes not all at one time so one might lag in relaxation until a full cure occurs.

My advice; don't let chiropractors touch the neck. See my video posts... YouTube; Kevin Sorbo, others injured, stroke... Type in Chiropractic stroke. Then see my ClarkClydeNight channel and go through some of the old and new book videos. Some are better than others, I am new at this video thing.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Bifocal - 07-18-2012

Try wearing your -1.75 glasses for reading only,and get some +1.75 over the counter readers,and wear them for distance,for a few hours each day.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Bifocal - 07-18-2012

Here is an explanation of why you should do as suggested in my previous post.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://gettingstronger.org/2010/07/improve-eyesight-and-throw-away-your-glasses/">http://gettingstronger.org/2010/07/impr ... r-glasses/</a><!-- m -->


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - clarknight - 07-19-2012

Bifocal-No! That's the dangerous Plus Lens method that Otis Brown advises. He has used it for years and his vision is very impaired. It causes cataract, astigmatism and other harm to the eyes health, vision. Read the old posts I placed on here to other groups where Otis admits he developed cataract and other problems and had to have eye surgeries and now has a prescription surgically placed in his cornea, lens; lasik on cornea, cataract lens replacement.

lou_deg please avoid this harmful method.

Clark Night


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - lou_deg - 07-19-2012

Clark, looks like you've been on this path I'm going through. I'll get in touch with you soon. I would appreciate the help.

The double vision is more pronounced for distance viewing, and my left eye sees worse. It's puzzling how my lenses, which have no astigmatic correction, removes the double vision if it is due to astigmatism. Yes, you are correct that the plain glasses blocks out the less clear double image from the primary one.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - lou_deg - 07-19-2012

Bifocal, I think you meant to say: use +1.75 for reading and -1.75 for distance?

I've actually tried wearing plus lenses for near vision a year ago and it was just tiring on my eyes. I tend to read a lot and when I wore them I didn't feel like reading much. I may have gotten too strong a lens. I didn't know this when I bought my plus lens but there is a +3 diopter rule, where you add +3 to your distance prescription (for reading at a distance of 1/3 meter). I like reading comfortably without the plus lens for now though.

I haven't gotten a chance to carefully read the link you gave but found the term double vision. It's interesting what it says there:

"...how to explain the transient “double vision” of focused and unfocused versions of an object that arise in the process of adaptation? ...The retina is not single plane...But the photoceptors are distributed over multiple layers. Presumably, the most active receptors are those which are usually stimulated by well-focused images. After all, those are the ones whose signals the brain can interpret, and they receive the most reinforcement. For a myope, these will tend to be the receptors in the focal plane of close objects, toward the back of the retina. Because the myope is doing a lot of close work and spends less time looking in the distance, the closer retinal cells get less stimulation and suffer from underuse. However, if these closer layers can gradually get more stimulation, or example by using plus lenses, they will adapt to increase in sensitivity and the strength of their signalling to the visual cortex will gain prominence. At some point, weak signals from this forward layer (on which there is a sharper image) will be sent simultaneously with the stronger signals form the backward layer (on which the images are blurred). During the period of adaptation, activation of multiple layers will be perceived as a double-image."

I was under the impression that the double vision is due to astigmatism but the above explanation says it may be spherical and happening at the retina. Very interesting theory!


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Weaself - 07-29-2012

Does the theory mean that if you have double vision, you need to practice more with big distance? I get even quadruple vision despite not having astigmatism, is that weird?


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - lou_deg - 02-22-2013

Grethel34s Wrote:Astigmatism is a vision problem caused by a distortion of the lens - would not usually in itself cause double vision.
I agree with your statement. But it's not just me seeing double, but everyone else who have astigmatism and as long as the spherical correction is not too high to blur it.

It has always baffled me how double vision arises when astigmatism is present. I have software for analyzing the effect of different types of aberrations in optical systems....and double images just don't happen. It is something related downstream in the vision process...at the retina or beyond.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Nini - 02-22-2013

lou_deg Wrote:I have software for analyzing the effect of different types of aberrations in optical systems....and double images just don't happen.

Here you can see the effect:
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.eorama.com/en/astigmatism.html">http://www.eorama.com/en/astigmatism.html</a><!-- m -->

And I believe, that astigmatism just like other vision problems is related to strain, when you are trying to force you eyes on a smaller point than what they are able to see in a relaxed way.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Imagineblack - 02-22-2013

Nini,

I looked up the astigmatism picture and it is very similar to the double vision I get. Is double vision mainly from astigmatism then? I'm wondering how to cure it. I'm working on my bad eye at the moment which does have astigmatism. I'm patching up the good one at times and letting the bad one work. It has been so rigid and seems to have built in pathways of movement; very little flexibility. I am practicing what feels like the next step for me which is letting the eye learn how to move again up and down, left and right and round and about. The eye seems to want to turn around to the bottom right. I have actually caught this eye close up on occasion squinting off to the right in the mirror and in my reflection in my mobile. My eye is starting to get stronger since I started and I'm gaining more control over it. I realized I had no chance of learning central fixation with this eye until I had control over its movement. I'm working on shifting within the Big C on my eye chart at the moment with my bad eye and it's really coming ahead now that it's movement is more controllable.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - lou_deg - 02-22-2013

Nini Wrote:Here you can see the effect:
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.eorama.com/en/astigmatism.html">http://www.eorama.com/en/astigmatism.html</a><!-- m -->
People can get creative with producing double images. I doubt this was done using a cylinder like the astigmatism in our eyes. Here is another way too.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.geology.neab.net/pictures/rock066.jpg">http://www.geology.neab.net/pictures/rock066.jpg</a><!-- m -->


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Nini - 02-22-2013

Imagineblack,
I had good success with relaxation, which I described here:
<!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.iblindness.org/community/viewtopic.php?p=18912#p18912">viewtopic.php?p=18912#p18912</a><!-- l -->
and a bit more detailed here:
<!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.iblindness.org/community/viewtopic.php?p=16949#p16949">viewtopic.php?p=16949#p16949</a><!-- l -->
And this was an attempt of an explanation:
<!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.iblindness.org/community/viewtopic.php?p=18914#p18914">viewtopic.php?p=18914#p18914</a><!-- l -->

I have one much weaker eye too (more than 3 diopters), which is progressing rather slowly and gets tired soon, then it gives me some trouble and it becomes difficult to keep up the clear sight of the other eye.
And I found out, that the more I consider this as a 'problem', 'hindering' my progress, the more it feels as if my both eyes were struggling against each other - as if the weaker one and actually my dominant eye was trying to claim its dominance and the better eye not strong enough to defend the clearer vision against the blur coming from the other side.
This causes a lot of tension in the muscles of the better eye, even pain.
I get much better results if I imagine, that I would 'persuade' my eyes to work together, each one bringing in the best of its capacities for an optimal result, the stronger one 'helping' the weaker one and so both of them will profit in the end.


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Bifocal - 02-22-2013

Imagineblack
The symptoms that you have said that you are experiencing,sound more like eye alignment problems,rather than astigmatism. Do you have any prism correction in your glasses?
Also I think that you would be better off patching your bad eye,and allowing the better one to improve first,and then the bad eye would have something reliable to work toward.Wearing plus glasses while the bad eye is patched would also be beneficial .


Re: double vision, due to astigmatism? - Nini - 02-23-2013

I would not patch the weaker eye, I think that would weaken it even more.
I tried with plusglasses - that is I put on +3 glasses and removed the glass on the weaker side to get 0 there. But I found this method rather straining; it helped in the beginning but then, because of increased strain, I didn't get more improvement - maybe if I had continued for longer and overcome the strain in the end....

But my weaker eye improved a lot just by trying to work with it positively (as I described above, not 'blaming' it fo hindering my progress). I can reach 20/40 to 20/30 on the eye chart with it and sometimes, when I close my better eye during the day I am really astonished how good the vision is with the other one. And with a little more patience...