+- Eyesight Improvement Forum (https://www.iblindness.org/forum)
+-- Forum: General Discussion (https://www.iblindness.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=4)
+--- Forum: Bates Method (https://www.iblindness.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Thread: A Second-Opinion Optometrist uses Bates -- Clears his Vision (/showthread.php?tid=537)
A Second-Opinion Optometrist uses Bates -- Clears his Vision - otis - 10-15-2007
We must realize that not ALL ODs are hostile to prevention -- only
some of them.
Here is a statement by Ray about his success in clearing
his Snellen using various methods:
============
Re:Voluntary clear flashes
To Dispersee from Ray G.:
In my opinion you should keep doing what you are doing. Quick
hard blinking is a form of relaxation. At some point the forced blink
will soften until finally you'll just have to imagine blinking to
clear your sight. That's what happened to me.
I totally reversed my myopia. It took me 1.5 years during which
I devoted a lot of time to doing Bates, yoga and other body and
relaxation practices. For the first six months I had no change in my
visual acuity. Then I had a flash of clear vision that lasted just a
few seconds. Then another about a month later, three weeks after that
and gradually more often. These were spontaneous flashes. One day it
occurred to me to try to create a voluntary flash. Several weeks
later I achieved a flash that resulted after about 30 minutes of
shifting, central fixation, visualization/memory (pure Bates stuff as
far as I understood it).
Over the next months I got better at creating voluntary flashes.
It took less and less time and the flashes stretched into moments,
then minutes and I could see clearly for longer and longer. I could
clear the distance with a quick deep blink and sustain it with
relaxed blinks and dynamic attention (Huxley's term) just as you
describe. Then I began to look into the distance every few minutes to
check my far vision and if blurry, to make it clear until one day I
looked up and realized that I could make it clear faster than it took
me to look. At that point I realized that even if I were still myopic
by some strict definition, it didn't matter because I could clear my
sight faster than I could change fixation from near to far and
therefore I had succeeded in curing my myopia. I didn't measure my
refraction at that time, but did later both subjectively (finding the
minimum lens for maximum clarity) and objectively (with a retinascope
and an automatic refractor).
Keep up the good work.
Ray Gottlieb
Ray Gottlieb, O.D., Ph.D.
336 Berkeley Street
Rochester, NY 14607
(585) 461-3716 Fax: 271-6924
Re: A Second-Opinion Optometrist uses Bates -- Clears his Vision - otis - 10-17-2007
Dear Friends,
Subject: Vision-clearing by a professional. He states that
it is not "easy".
There are two groups supporting prevention:
1. Bates teachers, who claim no medical training, but
will support you (under that understanding) with Bates
methods. You can use your own Snellen to verify your
results.
2. Medical people -- and their support. These are called
"Behavioral Optometrists". They use the Bates methods
on themselves and clear their vision. For that reason, if
you wish a medically trained person to help you -- look
for a BEHAVIORIAL optometrist in your area for that
type of assistance.
+++++++++
Dr. Ray Gottlieb's experience
by: "Ray Gottlieb" <!-- e --><a href="mailto:raygottlieb@frontiernet.net">raygottlieb@frontiernet.net</a><!-- e --> raymondgottlieb
I don't think the flashes of clarity after the quick squeeze blink
are due to changes in the tear film. It feels like the squeeze is
stretching the extra ocular muscles or maybe the pulley system that
these muscles pass through.
Yes, my objective refraction went to zero in both eyes. I didn't have
a large myopia to start, just -1.25 D (20/50) in my right eye and
-0.62 (20/30) in my left I was about 16-17 when my myopia first
began (freshman year in college) and about 30 when I started doing
Bates. I wore glasses only when I needed them. My eyesight cleared
before my refraction decreased. So I did have it easy because my
myopia was mild but I did work with a woman who started with -13 D
with -2 D of astigmatism. Both eyes were about the same. She worked
even harder than I did and last time I saw her she had worked down to
-6 D with no astigmatism and without glasses could get flashes of
20/40.
To John B. Yes, in a way improving eyesight is impractical. It takes
patience and energy (like meditation). I was very motivated. I was
myopic, an optometrist and interested in yoga, alternative life
styles and human potential. I didn't believe in Bates, I just wanted
to find out if it worked and treated the whole effort as an
experiment. I would make up little experiments, like spending three
hours in the park alternating sunning then palming then sunning then
palming, to see if anything changed in my sight.
Ray Gottlieb
Ray Gottlieb, O.D., Ph.D.
336 Berkeley Street
Rochester, NY 14607
Re: A Second-Opinion Optometrist uses Bates -- Clears his Vision - David - 10-17-2007
I'm surprised Ray would recommend this. I don't think it's tear film either - I've always thought it's pressure on the cornea. I don't remember how severe his myopia was, but I wonder if this is something that would be helpful to those with low myopia only, if anything. To me it's something that just encourages people to try to do something to their eyes to "fix" the blur, or push it away by force, and just encouraging strain.
Has anyone found it to be helpful as he describes?
David
Re: A Second-Opinion Optometrist uses Bates -- Clears his Vision - otis - 10-18-2007
Dear David,
Subject: The goal of presenting the preventive second-opinion
It is nice that Ray was willing to make these statements -- as
a full professional.
There are many ODs (majority-opinion) who will inform you
that "recovery" even from 20/70 -- IS IMPOSSIBLE. I consider
that majority-opinion bullshit. But I am willing to agree that
true vision-clearing depends on YOU -- and your monitoring
of your own Snellen.
I think that imagination-blindness is about:
1. The blindness of the majority-opinion -- in their denial
of the POSSIBILITY of prevention by these (and other)
methods.
2. EMPOWERMENT. I accept the fact that Ray was successful
because he PERSONALLY choose to do it. I think that must
be true of all of us.
3. People are complex -- and contradictory. Further a method
ONE person uses -- with success -- will fail totally on
the second person. I think this is the real reason
why Bates can not be "prescribed", but rather the person
must figure out what is important to him, and determine
if his goal (Improvement -- or Snellen Clearing) is worth the
effort.
In any event, I value Ray's success and his support for
these preventive methods. We should learn from them
before the situation gets to far out-of-hand.
Just one man's opinion,
Otis
Re: A Second-Opinion Optometrist uses Bates -- Clears his Vision - bjsilva - 10-18-2007
∓quot;David"\ Wrote:I'm surprised Ray would recommend this. I don't think it's tear film either - I've always thought it's pressure on the cornea. <snip>
Has anyone found it to be helpful as he describes?
David
Hi David (long time!),
I had always wondered about this. and it's interested to read what Ray wrote. I do agree there is the risk of someone using it to "fix" the blur, but I think they key to what Ray is saying is how he learned to maintain the clear vision - via "relaxed blinks" and "dynamic attention" (which I assume is directly or indirectly referring to shifting). Maybe when the eye muscles relax after the squeeze they relax more than they were previously.
This worked for me ever since the beginning, when my prescription was about -4.00 in both eyes. But I would say I took a similar path to Ray. Firstly I was using it to temporarily fix my vision, but then I learned that I could maintain it longer via gentle blinks and shifting.