Sun-gazing and after image - Printable Version
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Sun-gazing and after image - HareOm - 05-11-2008
I started sun-gazing in September for reasons of spiritual interest after reading the web-page of Hira Ratan Manek, and later learning some of his claims were exaggerated.
The point of this post is I am hitting and holding down ctrl and scrolling the mouse so I can actually see more clearly what I am typing [increasing text size quite a bit] so I do not make as many typos.
I have dealt with the persistent after-image from staring at the sun .... since starting, and occasionally stopping sun-gazing for a week or two so that it goes away to such an extent that though there when i close my eyes, is in no way detrimental to my vision.
now, I came across Dr. Bates information about how these after-images are illusions and that central fixation exercises will help eliminate them completely.
So, I have done those, and they help considerably.
What used to be the case was if I looked for something like an hour at the sun, i could hardly see anything at all, for....... hours, days?
Now its to where, I can look at even the noon-day sun for a little while, and though it causes the eyes to close (saying "no") to me, and when they close, I let them stay that way, and just occasionally open and close to get them used to it, and it works well.
My intution tells me that the sun-shine will eventually heal everything about my eyes in conjunction with the central fixation, and at this point I will no longer have an after-image.
I notice GREAT CLARITY in my vision, HOWEVER, the clarity is obscured by the after-image. I can see fine text a lot more, and I can actually justify saying "I don't need my glasses to drive."
i quit wearing them 2 years ago, out of reading that it would make the eyes stronger, it didn't really, but I got used to it
but the sun-gazing really has dramatically made t hem stronger
and yet, weaker, due to the after-image, in the way of anything in my central vision.
any ideas on this ?
I <3 the sun.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - Oleg K. - 05-12-2008
The reason of the after-images is strain. It can be easily demonstrated that after-images are volatile mental illusions caused by strain. It is not possible to have clear vision and at the same time to see an after-image, actually the opposite is the case. If you experience after-images, it means that you keep straining and must be doing something wrong when you look at the sun. Discretion must be taken for a person with imperfect sight when beginning to look directly at the sun, because it may cause you great discomfort, even though it's always temporary. If you don't take discretion and look at the sun with strain for a long time, you may cause yourself too much strain, that you may not yet know how to release and will have to suffer from the after-images until you learn to obtain relaxation with other methods. Remember, the only point to keep looking directly at the sun is when you don't feel ABSOLUTELY no discomfort, like if you were looking at a flower. The sun should appear pure white, the sun should swing, you should be able to look beside the sun, and the rest of the sky should not seem of strange color. Only then your eyes are strengthened with the sun rays. It's only THIS time that counts when you report how many minutes or hours you are able to look directly at the sun. If your eyes keep "telling no" and want to close, this time does not count, and it's actually a great strain to force them to stay open, and then you will experience bad after-images. If you do everything right, no after-images should appear at all - e.g. you turn your eyes down and read a newspaper right after sun gazing.
From what you describe, a whole hour or more of sun-gazing is almost surely an overdose of strain for you. For example, Rishi can look at the sun for only about 45 minutes, after years of practice. You better start with the burning glass and learn to stay absolutely comfortable in the bright light. Then begin to open your eyes carefully and with discretion. Then your after-images will go. I have made kind of the same error at the beginning of my sun-gazing experience, you can read about it on my blog: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://krupnov.blogspot.com/2007/08/7-tips-for-sungazing-learned-in-hard.html">http://krupnov.blogspot.com/2007/08/7-t ... -hard.html</a><!-- m -->
Actually I'm finding recently that this feeling of the great discomfort when exposing yourself to the bright light (photophobia) is a very useful symptom and an indication for sun treatment. It is not the goal to begin looking directly at the sun as soon as possible. One can sit in the sun rays with the eye closed and use the burning glass as long as needed until the discomfort goes away. The goal is to LET GO OF THE DISCOMFORT. Then comes the next stage, you open your eyes very naturally and can look directly at the sun with perfect comfort. During this stage you learn to maintain this state of relaxation gradually for longer and longer time, without falling back to the discomfort.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - HareOm - 05-12-2008
no there is no discomfort, they adjust very quickly, sometimes they want to stay only partially open
i can look for more than an hour a day, i've been doing it for months
i have congenital nystagmus, my chakras are wired wrong,
the sun is yellow, most times of the day its the same as looking at a flower, yes, only during say around noon is it slightly bright, but NOW it is not too bright at all, no matter what, no matter when.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - Oleg K. - 05-12-2008
Well, no one can tell better about your case than you, but I still feel you are doing something wrong. Otherwise you wouldn't have the after-images.
The sun is WHITE, the whitest white there is. If it seems yellow, you are straining.
Also, the eyes should open wide all by themselves. If they stay partially opened, you are straining.
The very first time when I looked directly at the sun, I strained a lot, and after few minutes I developed an intense yellow after-image that covered the sun and made it seem yellow and no longer so intolerably bright. This is however a very wrong way of decreasing the discomfort, because it's not relaxation but in reverse, increase of the strain to such a degree when the vision lowers and becomes no longer sensible to the light.
Bates refers to such cases in his Chapter XVII:
In exceptional cases persons with defective sight have been able to look at the sun, or have thought that they have looked at it, without discomfort and without loss of vision; but, as a rule, the strain in such eyes is enormously increased and the vision decidedly lowered by sungazing, as manifested by inability to read the Snellen test card. Blind areas (scotomata) may develop in various parts of the fieldâtwo or three or more. The sun, instead of appearing perfectly white, may appear to be slate-colored, yellow, red, blue, or even totally black. After looking away from the sun, patches of color of various kinds and sizes may be seen, continuing a variable length of time, from a few seconds to a few minutes, hours, or even months. read full
Does your vision immediately improves after sun gazing?
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - HareOm - 05-14-2008
how does the burning glass work?
I am reading about it and it sounds like what I need, it sounds very very very very helpful in sky-rocketing healing
i just take any sort of magnifying glass like instrument and she the light around my eyes, moving it to and fro ?
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - Kazekage - 05-14-2008
Yeah, and look downwards while you do it so that the pupil isn't exposed. Practice on your hand first, maybe.
See this video: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.sistemabates.it/sunglass.avi">http://www.sistemabates.it/sunglass.avi</a><!-- m -->
Oleg K. is the EXPERT on this stuff - read his blog for incredibly concise, detailed and helpful directions.
The PerfectSight yahoo group has loads of posts on this subject too, so you should join (for 1 euro).
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - Oleg K. - 05-14-2008
You make me smile by calling me an expert. If I were an expert, I would have already cured myself, right? So beware of creating false authorities.
On my blog there's a picture of the sunglass that I use myself and an instruction about how I use it: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://krupnov.blogspot.com/2007/09/how-to-use-burning-glass-on-yourself.html">http://krupnov.blogspot.com/2007/09/how ... rself.html</a><!-- m -->
I've been recently thinking that I may not have been aware that the burning glass is even MORE efficient than direct sun-gazing, yet it is safer, does not cause after-images, and can be used by anyone. Here's a quote from Bates I've stumbled upon: ... In all abnormal conditions of the eyes, light is beneficial. It is rarely sufficient to cure, but is a great help in gaining relaxation by other methods. The quickest way to get results from the curative power of sunlight is to focus the rays with a burning glass on the white part of the eye when the patient looks far downward, moving the light from side to side to avoid heat. This may be done for part of a minute at frequent intervals. Looking at the sun, while slower in its results, has often been sufficient to effect permanent cures, sometimes in a very short time. (BEM June 1920)
It's sunny weather in the few recent days, and I do a lot of sun treatment. I experiment with the feeling of discomfort, because it's such a vivid manifestation of the strain, and it lets me discover a lot about the way I strain. For example, I am usually able after some preparation to look directly at the sun for a few seconds without discomfort, but then the discomfort may return. I have to balance somehow to let go of the discomfort again and continue sun gazing. This way I understand how strain fluctuates all the time, and that's why and how the flashes of improved vision come and go, and how I can prolong them.
Also I have found it beneficial to find additional ways to reveal more hidden discomfort during sun treatment. For example, I've found that it's causing me more discomfort when I look at the sky near sun and notice the sun in the eccentric field of vision, than when I look directly at the sun. When I first become able to look anywhere in the sky with comfort, looking at the sun becomes very easy, comfortable and may be lasting for any duration of time. So I began practicing regularly long swing with my head up to the sky. BTW, it is also what the burning glass does - it forces one into a great discomfort of tolerating the sun in the eccentric field of vision, and this time there's no escape in turning the eyes up - because the light comes through the walls of the eyeball and the eyes are already under the lids, so the eyes have nothing to do but accept the strong light, and after the initial cramp goes, a great level of relaxation and comfort is immediately obtained. That's why the burning glass may be more effective than direct sun gazing.
I've also found that when I look at the sun with comfort, it is swinging like crazy. At the same time, I can easily remember swinging black dot. Also, I blink with normal frequency, not too often. At such periods it feels so comfortable like I could look at the sun forever and after I turn my eyes back to earth, I always have great flashes of clear vision and no afterimages at all.
With each next day, it appears more and more easy and quick for me to get accustomed to the strong light and begin feeling comfortable. It also makes me think that people underestimate the value of just following the instructions exactly, persistently and regularly. We just don't know what we are looking for and how it will be feeling like and so change our minds too often...
Interesting also that the discomfort from looking at the sun feels like extreme sleepiness and an urge to drive the eyes up under the lids. Bates wrote that sleepiness and fatigue are caused by mental strain, and it seems I'm beginning to understand how it works. Sometimes when I want to let go of the discomfort, it feels like if I command myself or do something I usually do to wake up from sleep. Isn't it also very promising to learn to become untiring by getting rid of mental strain!
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - HareOm - 05-16-2008
i find this all very interesting
i was talking about sun-gazing on another forum and some guys talking about Galilleo and ultra-violet spectrums and such and such, Bates seems to have disproved every single idea about sunshine being bad for the eyes imaginable, including the UV spectrum, isn't this so?
but my vision is better from staring at the sun lol, geeze, even with the after-image, its still more acute than it used to be.
i need to fashion a burning glass then, my strain is very odd and both eyes do not strain equally, t he right eye wants to close and lower itself while the left stays open.
after looking at the sun the strain is very evident, i didn't realize that the strain was always there, is this the case? i thought they just hurt from the sun, but i guess it is just showing me how they are always tense ?
SUN CHARGED EYEDROPS HELP SO MUCH
take a glass of water and sitting it on a window getting 2-3 hours of sun, then using the water as eye-drops.
its also so healthy to drink, charges the energy centers with good warmth.
when i was really little i looked at the sun for just a second to see if it really was bad for your eyes, and i didn't seem to think so, so I asked my mom "how long is it safe to look at it" she didn't want me to but said if it was just really quick it wouldn't hurt, but told me in a fearful superstitious way not to do it (sort of fearful...)
have any of you noticed the spiritual benefits of gazing, gone without hunger? if i don't eat anything and every-time i get hungry i sun-gaze it takes the hunger and makes it very mild, so it makes me curious that many claim we can photosynthesize, for a period of weeks without having hunger, some claiming full inedia, but, apparently, many of them being frauds.
a woman in the yahoo sun-gazing group recently went 38 days without being hungry though, with an hour of sun-gazing a day.
do i need to do other eye-exercises to improve my vision, an does bates have any information on nystagmus and congenital nystagmus or will the burning glass and the sun-gazing get me to perfect vision in time ?
when i have some money i'll go get a magnifying glass of some kind, i know we used to have one lying around!
to me the most important thing about this is just how refreshing and clean sun-gazing makes me feel physically and mentally
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - HareOm - 05-16-2008
another question I like to stick my hands in front of my face, and open two small slits through the fingers so that at any time of day, I can look at sun, deflecting much of the brightness,
is this dangerous in any way ? it could be letting tons of brightness in, without my eyes knowing, and therefore, i shouldn't do ? or is it the same principle as using a burning glass, it is just concentrating the light differently ?
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - clarknight - 06-15-2011
Oleg, I like your Blog. Tell me; Is that a regular magnifying glass? How is the Sunglass different, (if its different) form a magnifying glass bought in a store; certain strength, angle, shape of theglass..?
Natural Vision Improvement teachers are afraid to write, teach about the sunglass, probally since it can burn the eye if done wrong.
I get e-mails from people that use it.
Recently a man that was almost blind wrote and called me; he been using a regular magnifying glass as a sunglass, following Bates directions and blindness in one eye healed and the other eye getting better. Also he been doing all Bates Mehtod activities for a couple months.
Two other people with cataract, glaucoma and a retina problem, hole, fliun in retina have gained much benefit by the Bates MEthod. Stopping glasses is a main thing they do and it seems to help the circulation, pressure, in the eye and the eyes movement return to normal so the eye can heal.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - Oleg K. - 06-15-2011
Yes, it's a regular magnifying glass. Any magnifying glass, sufficient in diameter and + diopters will do.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - clarknight - 12-22-2012
Oleg, please give your ideas on my post here. Whats your opinion? Any suggestions? I don't want to be too negative on this subject because it truly helps many people. Authors should place all this in their books so people can do it right. Got another blind guy contacted me. Gets light images in flashes from open eyes sunning but limits it, is afraid of it and won't try sunglass. I wish he would try it but hes 1000 miles away so I can't help him in person. Wish to find list of doctors that willl do house call, sunglass treatment for these people. Maybe some of us can combine all our experience and give the doctors, (if we can find any) a booklet of instructions? If you could do it, without problems from the AMA...; make a book of your Blog's Sunlight, sunning, sunglass info. Try Amazon Createspace, its free.
Thoughts on the Sunglass
This is an old time Bates method treatment and it can heal some types of blindness, advanced eye problems, cataract. It must be preserved but done correct;
Authors, teachers placing this method in their books should teach advanced directions for safety of the Sunglass because; it is a magnifying glass and sunlight passing through a magnifying glass can burn, blind the eye. Dr. Bates is not here now to apply it, teach us how to use it correct. The sunglass is not needed except sometimes in advanced cases of vision impairment, blindness and is best to be done by an expert, Ophthalmologist experienced in the Bates Method. Since this type doctor is very hard to find, people often apply this method on their own or with a friends help. Be careful! Study the directions completely! I like Olegsâs advanced directions and I have written a few others (not all placed here).
The Sunglass and open eyed sunning are not needed for most cases. Open-eyed sunning is also controversial due to the depletion of the planets ozone layer from pollution so detailed instructions, precautions must be given. Vision can become clear, eyes healthy with use of the Bates Method, avoiding eyeglasses and obtaining natural exposure to normal sunlight; by just walking outside daily, looking at the bright sky, trees.., (no; eyeglasses, tinted glasses, sunglasses, uv blocking glassesâ¦). I use some open-eyed sunning, look directly at the sun but with eye movement, specific directions, time limit. I like to watch, copy animals, birds natural reaction to the sun, their instincts.
Keep in mind that the Sunglass is a magnifier and similar to a reading eyeglasses prescription; sunlight passing through it becomes unbalanced, no longer full spectrum, it converts to partial spectrum light which is not healthy, it's not the healthy beneficial full spectrum sunlight we get when itâs not passing through glass, plastic, windows, glasses... People that use the Sunglass every day or weekly... are placing unbalanced, partial spectrum light on the eye. (Never on, in the pupil. Yes only on the sclera, white of the eye.) This continual exposure to unbalanced sunlight is unhealthy.
I prefer direct full spectrum, balanced sunlight on the sclera (white of the eye, pulling the eyelids down, up while looking with the pupil away from the sun. Move the head side to side so the light moves upon the white of the eye.) without the light passing through the sunglass or any type of glass, plastic, eyeglasses, sunglasses...
I combine this with closed eyed sunning and a bit of occasional open-eyed sunning done correct with eye, head movement, blinking, long swing, sway, figure eight.
Good nutrition, diet, no drugs, chemicals. Healthy eyes, body work best with healthy full spectrum sunlight.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - clarknight - 04-25-2013
No one has replied to this so I been burning my brain figuring this out.
I am now on the Sun-Glass (Burning Glass. Itâs a convex plus lens âsmall magnifying glassâ). Treatment for the blind only. I consider it not needed in most cases and should be done by an expert, Bates Method Ophthalmologist âif you can find one' because it can be risky if done wrong. I learned a lot on here and in Dr. Bates magazines, book but; no one, not even in the magazines or book (as far as I can find, maybe I missed it?) has given exact directions for this treatment. I will state results of an experiment. Any suggestions are welcome;
1 - Size of the magnifying glass? In Bates book âPerfect Sight Without Glassesâ it shows a small glass. What is the exact width, height across the circular glass from one side to the other.
2 - Diopters; strength, thickness, amount of curvature of the glass; amount of magnification, how strong must the light emitted be to be effective but also safe, not too hot?
3 - After knowing the exact size, strength... then; what is the exact safe distance to place the glass from the eye so it does not burn the eye? (also; any specific angle? - or just directly in front of the sun as the glass directs the light down onto the upper sclera. (Always in movement to prevent heat, burning.) Directions must be exact because a magnifying glass can burn the eye, cause a ulcer... Strength of the sun's light; time of day, location on the planet, ozone layer/state all affect the heat from the concentrated light rays coming out of the glass. Continual movement of the glass helps to prevent burning of the eye but;
I want to know the safe distance of a non-moving glass, because; when I know a non-moving glass, of certain size, strength 'diopter' ... at -- ? -- inches will not burn the eye, then I know I am safe. The movement of the glass will give more insurance of safety.
I tested a magnifying glass on my hand today; Massachusetts, central area of the state, 5:30 pm, sunny, semi warm day. For A to E the glass and emitted light on the hand was kept still, immobile. (Note Dr. Bates says to move the glass, light to prevent heat, injury.)
A - At 6-5 inches from my hand, holding the glass, light beam still in my hand for 10 seconds; no heat, did not burn my hand. The light coming out the glass and onto my hand was large, not very bright or intense and was the shape of my glass; square (I prefer a circular glass but for now using this).
B - At 4 inches; the square of light gets smaller and brighter. 12 seconds on hand, immobile, no burn.
C - At 3 inches the light starts to form a circle, is smaller, much brighter, stronger. (I get a temporary light spot after image in my vision just looking at the light spot on a piece of paper) Placed it on my hand, immobile; in 3 seconds burned my hand! Hot!
D - At 2 Â½ to 2 inches itâs a well-defined, clear circle, much smaller, and intensely bright, much stronger light. Immobile. Burns the hand in 3 seconds or less.
E - Moving the glass closer to 1 inch, and Â½ inch; the circle gets larger, turns into a square, still pretty bright but less bright and the edges seem brighter at some distances. As compared to (A) 6 inches; this square at Â½ to 1 inch is well defined and much brighter but not as intensely bright as the small circles at 3-2 inches.
Placed the hand in the light of the square at 1 and 1/2 inch for 10 seconds; no intense burning of hand; only a little burn of heat starting after 10 seconds.
F - Repeated with the glass at 3 and 2 inches for 10 seconds and did not burn the hand as long as I kept the glass-spot of light continually moving. (But this distance, light is still too strong, intense.) Maybe 5 to 5 Â½ inches from the eye with movement of the glass would be safest, least heat. The light spot cannot be too big because it must not shine into the eyes pupil; only on the upper sclera, white of the eye. So; circle too small=burns the eye. Too big= might spread light into the pupil (even though the eye looks far down, pupil protected, covered best as can be under the lower eyelid.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - clarknight - 04-26-2013
Dr. Bates magazines say the sun-glass is convex 18 D. (diopters I presume) Seems strong to me. If a lower diopter glass is used; 5...? will it lower the strenght-heat, reduce chance of buring the eye and will it still be effective?
Still searching the mags... for the correct distance of the glass.
I am going to put all this information together and find the complete answers. Not many teachers show us this, none that I can find give complete directions and the two expert people (oleg and giovanni) that have posted here in the past and elsewhere, their blog... have not answered all these questions. I must rely only on Dr. Bates teaching from his mags, book and my own trial and error. I have found a few mistakes in other teacher's posting on the internet.
Searching burning glass, sunglass in all Bates work.
Re: Sun-gazing and after image - maorseven - 04-26-2013
I suffer from astigmatism. I used to practice sungazing for six months for the duration of 30-45 minutes daily, during sunrise. There was one instance where I foolishly experimented with prolonged SG and gazed at the sun as long as an hour and a half approximately. As the intensity of the sun increased, I could clearly sense it heating my eyes. My memory of this incidence is now partial, but I can recall that, afterwards, I continued seeing vivid afterimages of the sun with bright colors for two weeks and believing that I had damaged my eyesight permanently. I cannot recall whether I experienced lasting afterimages during previous instances of SG.
Six months have passed since the discontinuation of the SG habit, and - to this day - a small, light dot can be seen at the center of my vision. Usually, I am able to forget its existence. During the past month, the astigmatism has deteriorated abruptly and eye-aches resulting from looking at near objects has first appeared. While being examined by an eyedoctor, he diagnosed macular scars characteristic of SG and remarked that no connection exists between these and astigmatism.
Are macular scars curable? Since some of those who participated in this thread practice SG, I wonder what is your stance regarding macular scarring.